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Rant: "Upgrading" Vintage Drums Last viewed: 2 hours ago

Posts: 182 Threads: 32

Just need a place to rant on this. Chime in or disagree as you see fit - both are welcome.

Is it just me or does anyone else think murderous thoughts when they see an ebay listing for vintage drums and the seller says something like "bass drum upgraded with modern spurs"? The words "upgrade" and "vintage" do not belong in the same sentence, unless that sentence is "I upgraded from vintage drums to modern drums". Even then, I wouldn't say you upgraded.

We all know that the vintage 50's & 60's hardware wasn't the most sturdy or user friendly compared to today's gear (rail mount adjustment much?). But at the same time, drummers didn't play like Dave Grohl back then either.

I hate that some idiot put WFL spurs on my Slingerland BD. I've been scouring ebay & VDF for those special Slingerland spurs that are bent at the top and use the floor tom mounts. They're certainly not an upgrade. They don't even stay in position. But you can bet if I had a WFL kit with them on there, I'd happily live with it.

I think we should be able to shut down ebay listings for vintage gear that say "upgraded".

That is all.

'56 Slingerland Krupa Set - Sparkling Gold Pearl
60's WFL Orphans Club Date - Black/Gold Duco (20/13/15)
Posted on 11 years ago
#1
Posts: 5550 Threads: 576

From groovesonly

Just need a place to rant on this. Chime in or disagree as you see fit - both are welcome.Is it just me or does anyone else think murderous thoughts when they see an ebay listing for vintage drums and the seller says something like "bass drum upgraded with modern spurs"? The words "upgrade" and "vintage" do not belong in the same sentence, unless that sentence is "I upgraded from vintage drums to modern drums". Even then, I wouldn't say you upgraded.We all know that the vintage 50's & 60's hardware wasn't the most sturdy or user friendly compared to today's gear (rail mount adjustment much?). But at the same time, drummers didn't play like Dave Grohl back then either. I hate that some idiot put WFL spurs on my Slingerland BD. I've been scouring ebay & VDF for those special Slingerland spurs that are bent at the top and use the floor tom mounts. They're certainly not an upgrade. They don't even stay in position. But you can bet if I had a WFL kit with them on there, I'd happily live with it.I think we should be able to shut down ebay listings for vintage gear that say "upgraded".That is all.

id prefer retro-mod as in hot-rods

that can be done with anything, its just not correct original, big difference in price...

April 2nd 1969 scarfed pink champagne holly wood and 65/66 downbeat snare, and , supra same year very minty kit old pies
66/67 downbeat with canister
Super 400 small round knob
1967 super classic obp





once the brass ceases to glitter, and the drum looses its luster, and the stage remains dark, all you have left is the timbre of family.
Posted on 11 years ago
#2
Posts: 1311 Threads: 9

From groovesonly

Just need a place to rant on this. Chime in or disagree as you see fit - both are welcome.Is it just me or does anyone else think murderous thoughts when they see an ebay listing for vintage drums and the seller says something like "bass drum upgraded with modern spurs"? The words "upgrade" and "vintage" do not belong in the same sentence, unless that sentence is "I upgraded from vintage drums to modern drums". Even then, I wouldn't say you upgraded.We all know that the vintage 50's & 60's hardware wasn't the most sturdy or user friendly compared to today's gear (rail mount adjustment much?). But at the same time, drummers didn't play like Dave Grohl back then either. I hate that some idiot put WFL spurs on my Slingerland BD. I've been scouring ebay & VDF for those special Slingerland spurs that are bent at the top and use the floor tom mounts. They're certainly not an upgrade. They don't even stay in position. But you can bet if I had a WFL kit with them on there, I'd happily live with it.I think we should be able to shut down ebay listings for vintage gear that say "upgraded".That is all.

+1.I totally agree.If you want to hot-rod vintage drums,then buy up some orphans,or drums in need of restoration,because of finish or extra holes,and leave the stuff that's original and intact ....alone.It's also cheaper to do it that way.

Steve B

Posted on 11 years ago
#3
Posts: 2809 Threads: 32

Ringo started it. No real American drummer would have put Swivomatic mounts on a Ludwig kit or Gretsch, or Slingerland, or you name the brand.

No, that wasn't a serious comment. But, Ringo did do it.

For as long as there have been drums, drummers have been doing stuff to make what they bought better than what was made. And, at the same time, quite a number of guys pretended they liked what they bought and left well enough alone. All the while, some drum hardware was the ultimate of technological evolution at the time, aka, Swivomatic in 1960. And that, reigned supreme for a good 15 years, it was only CBS making cast collet tensioners that reduced the value of Swivomatic. Rogers introduced Memriloc and a new standard was born. It was copied by Pearl, Ludwig, and a few others came up with their own "bullet proof" hardware designs. You do not see Memriloc on 60s Rogers drums as a rule, you are more likely to see Pearl mounts drilled into 60s Rogers primarily because someone lost the hardware and someone else ended up with the drums, not because it was an "upgrade." Eventually, somebody else has to sell that pile of S, and its called an upgrade. You do see Memriloc on a lot of Fullerton 9/72 drums, and considering the collet tensioners being what the were, it was an upgrade. A serious reduction in modern value to the drums, but, they are still Rogers and sound good, Memrilock or no.

If the Slingerland mounts were so bad as to need changing when the drums were fairly new.... its vintage and was an upgrade to whomever did it at the time. He wasn't a collector, he was probably a working drummer who couldn't afford the drums of the hardware he chose, and replaced the hardware on the drums he got. Just like Ringo, in a way.

Rogers Drums Big R era 1975-1984 Dating Guide.
http://www.vintagedrumforum.com/showthread.php?t=24048
Posted on 11 years ago
#4
Posts: 5356 Threads: 87

Oh the horror~!

1 attachment
bobbycolomby drums pic.jpg
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Glenn.

Not a guru just havin fun with some old dusty drums.
Posted on 11 years ago
#5
Posts: 51 Threads: 20

I've been playing on my vintage sonor teardrops while I'm "in between" modern kits. Love the sound, absolutely, can't stand the hardware, particularly the kick. If I was serious about using them regularly I'd "upgrade" in a heartbeat.

Posted on 11 years ago
#6
Posts: 6583 Threads: 644

From FFR428

Oh the horror~!

Bobby might have ordered them without Premier mounts....

"Always make sure your front bottom BD lugs clear the ground!"
Posted on 11 years ago
#7
Posts: 1094 Threads: 183

Agree. I hate that as well. I want the drum the way it was made.

(& most of the time the upgrades I see on Feebay stink).

Posted on 11 years ago
#8
Posts: 715 Threads: 59

From The Ploughman

If the Slingerland mounts were so bad as to need changing when the drums were fairly new.... its vintage and was an upgrade to whomever did it at the time. He wasn't a collector, he was probably a working drummer who couldn't afford the drums of the hardware he chose, and replaced the hardware on the drums he got. Just like Ringo, in a way.

I owned a Rogers Dayton era 22/12/16 in gold sparkle where the Swivo tom mount was swapped out and drilled for a Slingerland Set-O-Matic tom arm and mount. That one was definitely a head scratcher!

1957 George Way BDP 26" concert bass drum
1959 George Way BDP 22/12/16 w/ 5.5x14
1959 George Way Green Sparkle 22/12/16 w/5.5x14
1961 George Way Blue Sparkle 20/12/15
1961 George Way Jelly Bean 20/12/14 w/4.5x14
1960’s Camco Oaklawn Champagne 20/12/14/16w/5x14
1971-73 Camco Chanute Walnut 24/14/18 w/5x14 COB
Posted on 11 years ago
#9
Posts: 2809 Threads: 32

From DolFan54

I owned a Rogers Dayton era 22/12/16 in gold sparkle where the Swivo tom mount was swapped out and drilled for a Slingerland Set-O-Matic tom arm and mount. That one was definitely a head scratcher!

Ok..... that one just simply cannot be explained.

Rogers Drums Big R era 1975-1984 Dating Guide.
http://www.vintagedrumforum.com/showthread.php?t=24048
Posted on 11 years ago
#10
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