Can't this be reported or does one have to wait till someone gets screwed first? I don't do enough ebay to know..

OK, calm down, I ended the listing, I honestly thought it was a Slingerland when I first listed the snare. Since the snare sounds so good, I've decided to keep it anyway.

It has the original Slingerland strainer and butt plate, so I'll probably just clean it up and make it look as nice as possible. Kleening

The auction was ended, I'm sure he took it down to correct his auction.

Nothing against you personally Johnnyringo..Just got fired up about the fact that someone maybe trying to pull a scam on e-bay! Lately I have seen many of them. Should have given you the benefit of the doubt...seeing that you did come here seeking advice!!DOH

Harry

Jonnystix; I understand your love and appreciation of M.I.J. drums, but I don't think that an M.I.J shell would come anywhere near the sound of a single ply steambent RK shell. I have 2 RKs and they sound way better than any of my ply drums. And those drums are Ludwig and Montinari.

the outer ply is going up and down, Slings were all horizontal inside and outer layers, middle was verticle.

Never did say they are as nice as a steam bent shell, what I said was that if you guys are open minded enough to look into reworking these pitiful old cheap snares and put a little effort into them, you might find that you can get a great drum for nearly nothing. They do not sound, nor will they ever sound the same. Please, don't put words in my mouth, I am merely trying to get you guys to see that there are some of these old drums that, when properly worked, can give you a sound you never thought possible because many, not all of you guys constantly trash, without further investigation, these copies.

I am not ignorant, I am open to ideas and trying some techniques that bring out the very best of these drums. I know that most of you had these 30-40 years ago and hated them. I get that. What you don't get is that by taking the experience you have gained, today, and applying it to these drums can make you a gigging kit that looks and sounds more than adequate, and you don't have to risk injury or certain loss to your irreplacable vintage American stuff. For 200 bucks, and a few hours of labor, you can have a killer set of drums. That is all I am trying to get you guys to see. These shells are aged, no less than your old American counterparts, and if you take the time to locate a set of 2, 3 or 4 ply MIJ shells, and you could get very lucky and get a complete set of vintage cymbals as well, for near nothing, comparitively speaking, that can be made into great sounding drums.

Unless and until you try to make something out of nothing, please stop constantly bashing those of us that have been enlightened. If you have tried and not succeeded, ask a few questions, I will bet you missed something. But just because you had a set 30-40 years ago and couldn't get them to sound good then, doesn't mean anything, you were "ignorant", not stupid, ignorant, uneducated. Stupidity is the refusal of education, not the lack of. Lack of education is ignorance.

I love vimtage drums, no matter whether American or MIJ or European...makes no matter to me, the sound is what matters. If you hate old Japanese drums, fine, I can't understand why, but go right ahead and hate them, that means more for me to play with, but constantly bashing them and those of that have found a fun and cheap way to enjoy the hobby is just plain rude. If you don't like 'em, oh well. I can make money on them because I can buy them really cheap, restore them and sell them for a modest price and do it again. You don't get that many opportunities with American drums, they sell for too close to market 95% of the time, and when they are cheap, they are 95% of the time trashed.

All I am trying to get through is that these are viable drums, they are not the trash that some people portray them to be. They are not the "evil empire's attempt to take over the market", as some have suggested. Yes, the Japanese flooded the market with them, and yes, the quality is not the same as most American drum makers. But you know what? If there had not been a market, the market would have taken care of itself. And my money says this forum would not exist today because there would not be 25% of the drummers there are today. Many families could not justify the cost of Slingerland, Ludwig, Rogers, Gretsch, or even Kent drums in the 60s, period. And had the Japanese drums not existed in the quantities they did...well, it's pure math, you can extrapolate it out to see the number of drummers would not be near what it is today.

This is not a rant aginst you, atomic, it is a rant that says I am tired of some people constantly bashing, without doing the work. There are a handful, and they know, that have not nor will they ever, do the work, yet continue to scream bloody foul, and I will bet have never done more than a cursory set only because they had to. Yet they are the authority on everything drums, American and Japanese. Even though they will not play that crap...so...how can it be they know the truth.....?

Oh yeah, their buddy had a set of Apollos 40 years ago...and since they were kids, they did not know how to make them sound better, so they are still automatically trash. Makes perfect sense to me.