Only Admins can see this message.
Data Transition still in progress. Some functionality may be limited until the process is complete.
Processing Attachment, Gallery - 188.38413%

Help with 1920s Ludwig badges and lugs

Posts: 7 Threads: 1

Hi everyone!

Got this 'kit' yesterday.

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg275/drumdriver/210320121063.jpg

kick drum is ludwig (14X27&1/2"-yes, 27&1/2...is that unusual?)

and snare (6X15") looks to have matching shells and wooden rims to the kick. (Pictured on top are the bass drum lugs, and some other lugs I bought off ebay that I thought were original and would fit...but to my dismay I didnt take into account the extra 2 inches for the wooden rims so theyre not big enough! perhaps they were from say an old ludwig tango snare?)

[IMG]http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg275/drumdriver/210320121064.jpg[/IMG]

The lugs it came with look unoriginal to me (not ludwig) -I have interestingly seen these on a Lyon and Healy marching drum in the gallery here at VDF.

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg275/drumdriver/210320121075.jpg

The snare rims have the standard cut out sections for where the snare wires feed through,

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg275/drumdriver/210320121070.jpg

but of interest to me is the snare shell has two scoops cut out where the snare wires would run (adjacent to where the strainer and butt plates go). Is this particular for a kind of marching snare where say a belt or shoulder strap would feed through under the head? Ive never seen these cut outs on a shell before and hope someone can shed some light.

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg275/drumdriver/210320121067.jpg

Both shells have been painted by someone I think to emulate the early shell two-tone 3-band-stripe finishes. On close inspection it looks a bit too rough to be the original factory finish in my opinion but I may be wrong!

Neither shells have their badges still or any rim stamps etc, but they have the holes and marks visible where the original badges and snare strainer etc were that may provide some clues as to their era and identification...

Snare rim holes where badge was (badge was oval, marks are 1.5"X1":

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg275/drumdriver/230320121086.jpg

Snare shell where strainer and butt plate were (badge/strainer marks are circular, 2" diameter, .75" centre hole:

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg275/drumdriver/210320121068.jpg

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg275/drumdriver/210320121069.jpg

Bass drum shell has 3 sets of holes.

One in top centre middle (circular mark, badge mark is 1.75", centre hole 0.75"):

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg275/drumdriver/210320121078.jpg

One on left hand side middle (oval mark, badge mark is 1.5"X1.25", centre hole is 0.5"):

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg275/drumdriver/210320121080.jpg

and two matching pairs of holes set about a quarter of the way down either side of the shell from the top centre (maybe these held a marching strap bracket, or some kind of percussion/cowbell/cymbal holder?):

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg275/drumdriver/210320121079.jpg

My aim is to restore these to a decent condition and then play them live. I'm still undecided wether to sand back the paint to its natural wood finish, or leave the paint on and have a one-off looking old kit!? The timber shells underneath look to be in beautiful condition after a brief sand and wax. Suggestions?

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg275/drumdriver/210320121085.jpg

So the reason for my post is I am searching for answers and advice on how to restore these with their original badges and get them to a sexy but practical playing condition:

1. Could anyone lend their experience and expertise in helping identify which badges are missing from the shells? And if so, does anyone own any or know where to get some!?

2. Is the snare a ludwig (going by the rim badge 'ghost holes' or the strainer holes) or something else from the same era?

-and depending, are the lugs supplied with it original for the drum, or alternatively worth rejuvenating and keeping? ( if someone knows where I can get the proper original lugs, I would dearly love them) For restoring the snare, I was considering getting a ludwig new P86B Millenium strainer and P33B butt plate, a 15" snare wire set and two new heads (say weatherking vintage or fibre skins), and finishing the snare that way, in a practical rather than original sense, with the lugs that were supplied....any thoughts on this approach?

Apologies for a rather long enquiry, but VDF is the only place to ask really, and I think the more info and photos you can get definitely helps!!

Regards,

Drumdriver

www.myspace.com/drumdriver

Posted on 13 years ago
#1
Posts: 6288 Threads: 375

You've never seen snare beds on a snare shell before?

Link.....

Kevin
Posted on 13 years ago
#2
Posts: 7 Threads: 1

No I'm afraid! I'm used to the holes in the rim where the wires feed through, but not carved from the shell itself. Forgive my ignorance, I'm new to restoring vintage drums, that's why I'm here...seeking help and advice.

Posted on 13 years ago
#3
Posts: 747 Threads: 37

The bass drum is a Ludwig & Ludwig w/ an unoriginal finish. The snare is a Lyon & Healy , that was probably all natural wood at one time. (pics: Lyon & Healy 5 3/4" X 13 1/2", , w/ marching attachments. )

5 attachments
014.JPG
52.2 kB
015.JPG
60.7 kB
013.JPG
62.8 kB
008.JPG
55.2 kB
010.JPG
52.4 kB
Posted on 13 years ago
#4
Posts: 747 Threads: 37

Pics of the strainer, jaws & hooks for a marching snare. Do any of your claws have an extended portion w/ a hole, for the wire marching attachments ? The holes in the bass drum are probably from carrier bolts & the surrounding impressions are from the large washers that were used(pic of carrier bolt). I've also seen a simple round bracket in the top center of a L&L bass for a single post that held a cymbal, or Chinese tom, cowbell, etc.,

3 attachments
017.JPG
54.1 kB
019.JPG
45.8 kB
020.JPG
68.4 kB
Posted on 13 years ago
#5
Posts: 7 Threads: 1

Wow, thanks tdennis, they are awesome pics, very helpful, I appreciate your work in shedding some light on the Lyon & Healy snare.

Yes, the snare claws have the extended sections with the holes for the carry straps, but alas it did not come with the original strainer and attaching brackets as seen in your pics. They must be hard to come by!? ( I may have to restore with a different strainer to make it practical and playable.

So Im looking for a Ludwig & Ludwig badge then for the bass drum too, thankyou.

Does anyone have one they could sell me?

I guess I"ll probably sand the shells and rims back to original wood grain, now that I know the paint is not original, I will think about it.

I will track down pics of L&L bass drums now for reference.

Thanks for you help!

Posted on 13 years ago
#6
  • Share
  • Report
Action Another action
Something else here