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An open letter to the Ludwig drum company Last viewed: 13 hours ago

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Dear Ludwig drum company,

Let’s be very clear. There is no more important and influential drum company than you, Ludwig. Are there more modern, streamlined companies? With a wider range of sizes, material, finishes and hardware options? Possibly, I suppose. But more recorded, emulated, revered? Hardly.

By my estimation Ludwig has made it’s legend on the backs of four particular snare drums. The Supraphonic 5X 14 (Blaine, Mitchell, Baker, Watts, e.g.), the Supraphonic 6.5x 14 (Bonham, every other rock drummer ever) and the Black Beauty are the go-to, boilerplate snares for a wide range of drummers, live and studio, amateur and professional. It’s been said that if you’re only going to own one snare drum then one of these three would certainly be a wise choice. Old one, new one, doesn’t matter. They’re extremely consistent and I would bet almost any amount of money than in a blind test very, very few drummers would be able to tell the difference between a vintage Supraphonic and a brand new one. One in a hundred maybe. (I’m hedging a bit here because it’s my personal belief that absolutely NO drummer could tell the difference between the two in a blind test.) Ludwig has been building these three drums with little or no design changes for more than 50 YEARS. That's how good they are.

But there’s a fourth snare drum that you, Ludwig drum company, seemingly refuse to acknowledge. It’s like you’re trying to pretend that the single most important drum you ever produced does not even exist.

In May of 1963 Ringo Starr took possession of his first Ludwig kit. The snare he got with that kit became his favorite snare drum. He changed kits a few times, changed cymbals now and again, maybe even changed the heads occasionally (no one really knows and if Ringo knows, he ain’t talkin’) but he used that one snare drum always. It is THE most consistent musical element in the entire Beatles catalog. The other three changed guitars and amps year to year. That one drum was on every album (save the first, Please Please Me, which was recorded with his crap Premier kit) every single, every tour, every movie, T.V. appearance, promotional video, rooftop concert, all the time everywhere always.

And so I would argue that just as the entire late 20th-century revolved around the music of the Beatles, so the music of the Beatles revolved around Ringo’s Ludwig snare drum.

And what was this AMAZING drum? It was a 5.5x 14” 3-ply shell (mahogany, poplar, mahogany) with maple reinforcing hoops as was standard on Ludwig drums of the time. It had 8 tuning lugs (as opposed the modern standard of 10) and a simple throw-off. And that’s basically it. A 5.5x 14” 8-lug, wood shell snare- in my estimation THE single most important drum that you, Ludwig, have ever produced. John Bonham’s bass drums might be second, third and fourth. Blaine’s 5x14" Supraphonic might also come in second, but by a distance.

Now, can Joe Drummer, who just wants their own version of the most important snare of all time, get one? Absolutely. He can go on eBay and, like I did, wait for a 5.5x 14 mid-sixties Ludwig snare to show up and then drop upwards of 1200 bucks and it will be all his. And good luck. It only took me about three years.

And neither he nor I, an actual Ludwig artist (my name is on your artist roster- Ira Elliot, go check) can buy a drum like this from you today. You don’t make one. You haven’t manufactured a drum with these specs since the mid-sixties. You can't special order a 5.5" shell, I've tried. Maybe if I were Bun E. Carlos or someone like that you might, I can't say. But I doubt it.

Sure, you make a “Fab 22” kit. and let's not even get into how unlike Ringo’s kit the modern version (that you likely sells a **** ton of) is, all off the good name and legendary status that Ringo and Ludwig achieved together. It’s ridiculous. Curved spurs and a shell-mounted cymbal arm? Really?

And yet there is no Ringo-style 5.5x 14, 8-lug Legacy Classic snare. It’s a travesty. It’s like you give **** zero about the legend and legacy of a man who single handedly changed the fortunes of your company virtually overnight. (That night of course being February 9th, 1964- the date of the first Ed Sullivan performance). I can't think one of one drummer who would not consider owning such a perfect instrument were it made available.

So my question is this, Ludwig drum company- What the **** is wrong with you?

Ira Elliot

Nada Surf, Bambi Kino

Ludwig endorser/fanatic

Super Classic Oyster Blue Pearl '65-'67 12, 13, 14, 16, 20, 22, 14x 5.5 snare
Super Classic Maple Thermogloss 1971 13, 14, 16, 18, 24
Legacy Classic Green Sparkle '09-'11 12, 13, 14, 16, 22
Supraphonic 5x 14 1979
Supraphonic 6.5x 14
"The Chief" (Titanium) 6.5x 14
Supraphonic 6.5x 14 hammered bronze
Black Beauty 6.5x 14
Acrolite 6.5x 14 Black Galaxy
Stadium 8x 14 Walnut Lacquer
Posted on 10 years ago
#1
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Since they are making the Legacy Mahogany, I assume that they will make matching snares and 8 lugs is an option on their snare drums. So it could be a possibility it could happen. Sure it won't have a P83 or COB hoops or the white resocoat interior (I assume). It would still get you in the ballpark sonically.

Posted on 10 years ago
#2
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Mr. Elliot,

I certainly sense your passion in your post! I just want to cut to the chase and give my PERSONAL opinion on one of the most famous snare drums of all time. While much has been detailed about the depth of Ringo's snare drum, do we know, without a doubt, that it was precisely 5.5" in depth! Yes, I've read just about every article there is about this. Based on Ludwig's inconsistencies in manufacture, the shell could have been 5-3/8" or even 5-1/4". Regardless, Ringo's snare drum most likely used a shell held over from the "Barrett Deems" snare drum, which was a 5.5x14. However, Ringo's snare was officially a Jazz Festival, with an advertised depth of 5". I can't help but think that Ringo would have made a 5" depth sound the same as his 5.5". Still, has anyone every actually measured Ringo's snare to verify the actual depth? I'd love to know EXACTLY what depth it is.

Regardless, for many, I feel that the Ludwig Legacy 5x14 is as close as you're going to get. Seems like a fine drum to me...and I don't feel I'd miss that one-half inch...or less!

Just my :2Cents:

I'm looking forward to more replies from our members!

Mark

Posted on 10 years ago
#3
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As the proud and satisfied owner of a Barrett Deems snare, I occasionally check Ludwig's www site to see if they have a similar drum in production.

The closest I have seen is the Legacy, which misses on at least two counts, wood (maple instead of mahogany), and number of lugs.

As the proud owner of an Acrolite and a Supraphonic, I am well aware how the number of lugs can affect the sound of a snare drum. My Acrolite frankly kicks my Supraphonic's butt (to my sonic taste). Many if not most people might prefer the Supraphonic, but they do sound different.

I am with Ira; it seems silly not to have a Jazz Festival snare drum in production. Even one with a P85 and steel hoops would sell well.

-Erik
______
Early '70's Slingerland New Rock #50 in blue agate (20-16-13-12)
Late '50's WFL Swingster/Barrett Deems in black/gold Duco
'70's Slingerland Gene Krupa Sound King COB
early '70's Ludwig Acrolite
'80's Ludwig Rocker II 6 1/2" snare
Rogers Supreme Big "R" hi hat

Posted on 10 years ago
#4
Posts: 566 Threads: 101
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The market for a Ludwig 5.5x14 3ply shell (mahogany, poplar, mahogany ) is miniscule . It's 2015 not 1964 . Several Jazz Festivals have passed through my hands and I didn't hear anything that fabulous about their sound . An " exact " replica of Ringo's snare drum might sell as there are thousands of Beatles' copy band drummers or people owning black oyster kits w/o a matching snare out there that would purchase such a drum for $ 500-600 . Can the 60's black oyster be exactly duplicated ? I don't know .

1963 Gretsch Progressive Jazz Champagne Sparkle
1967 Ludwig Super Classic Oyster Blue Pearl
Yamaha Birch Custom Absolute Burgundy Spkl. bop
etc...
Posted on 10 years ago
#5
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Very interesting. Well written and quite passionate. I have a '68!Jazz Frstival that was given to me by a friend that was moving to Hawaii. Killer drum indeed.

I would take exception to the thought that a Premier kit was less than a great kit. Their shells sounded great, that mahogany durroplastic finish was way ahead of it's time their design aesthetic was uniqu and no one except possibly Sonor could equal their chrome work.

Otherwise, I love your passion!

tnsquint
Very proud owner of a new Blaemire Snare 6.5 x 14 made by Jerry Jenkins "Drumjinx"
Posted on 10 years ago
#6
Posts: 2753 Threads: 132
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Ira said: "I can't think one of one drummer who would not consider owning such a perfect instrument were it made available".

Do you see my hand up in the air? I have nothing against this drum. But, I don't obsess about it. I think that I'm far from being the only one. OK....If I found an original vintage one on the cheap, and could sell it to a obsessing drummer for an obscene profit, I'd want one. But, I'm very content with my favorite snares from other companies and my Blackro and Ludwig Standard snares.

No matter how far you push the envelope, it is still stationery.
Posted on 10 years ago
#7
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I have owned a lot of jazz festivals I have owned 3 barrett Deems they are great sounding snare drums I prefer the 5.5x14 more. But I don't see a swelling cry for them. Ludwig company of today is not Ludwig of the 60's. Selmer owning them now the company responds to consumer needs and wants. with the price of exotice woods always on the rise and hard to get at least the good woods anyway. They are doing a great job. I live near the factory and have been to it on many occasions the plant is running full steam. We have other Ludwig endorsers of a very high level here on the forum,They have never made these type of things public. As mentioned you have great passion for that particular drum. But a large company only responds to a lucrative market.

Your drummers not much good is he!? What you need is someone that's as good as me. ! John Henry Bonham !!
Posted on 10 years ago
#8
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It's not that hard to find a Jazz festival snare in other colors for a reasonable price if the sonic aspect is really what you are concerned about. I doubt that anyone can discern oyster black from champagne sparkle with a blindfold on.

I bought an entire Downbeat kit in champange sparkle with that snare drum for $1150 about 3 years ago because someone had added a center tom mount and ditched the rail. I've since sold it because I was impressed with nothing but the fact that it was very light and easy to haul to a gig. Ever tried to play that 14x14 with its original legs still on it? Very low indeed.

I don't think Ringo's snare made Ringo or the Beatles. It is fairly obvious that Brian Epstein was controlling the entire Beatles look into which the Ludwig oyster black set fit. I think he could have kept on playing the Premier or even used an English Rogers kit and they still would have rocked the world. However, Epstein was right to look at every detail of the band he was marketing.

And market them he did, such that we all saw it on the Ed Sullivan show - an oyster black Downbeat with a matching snare drum. If he'd been playing a Rogers red onyx Citadel with a wood shell Dynasonic (which of course he should have been), it would be worse than it already is to find that kit. It's just that, that it was what he had and we all emulated him to a certain extent. We wanted a share of what he so clealy was enjoying to the hilt way up there on his riser. Plus, we wanted to attract the girls like they didLaughing H

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Posted on 10 years ago
#9
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I had posted pictures of my Ludwig Classic Maple Downbeat in Galaxy Sparkle. The snare was ordered as an 8-lug, with P-85 and P-32 butt, as I wanted to replicate a Jazz Festival. This can also be ordered the same way in the Legacy series. I've also seen this drum, in Oyster Black, being offered for sale on the internet. True, it's a 5x14, but still qualifies as a Jazz Festival.

For drummers in Beatles bands, I'm sure they'd be more than happy with either the Classic Maple or Legacy series snare drums outfitted as a Jazz Festival and either will sound very good!

Mark

Posted on 10 years ago
#10
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