Are there really prototype drums out there?
Are they documented, and if so, how?
Is this just a catch-all term we turn to when we have mixed hardware/badges/labels/shell types, etc. etc. during transition periods?
One sees the term all over eBay, of course, but when I notice it on the drum forums, it raises some questions for me.
Just curious?
Anyone out there have some pics and supporting descriptions for their prototypes?
AS you do know there of course were the original ludwig Acrolite Prototypes.
I have one of the old Zickos "Supersonic" bass drums that was from one of the five (supposedly) prototype kits made when Zickos sold their name to another company in the mid 1970's for a short time. It's green resin fiberglass with a white gelcoat paint, no bearing edges to speak of and different size heads at each end (batter is a 22" and the resonant is a 16").
i had a ludwig kit with a prototype paint job. when it was given to me i was told to wrap it if i sold it,which i did.the shells were from the scrap/misdrilled/seconds shell pile because the toms were misdrilled.
i still have the toms. i just redrilled and wrapped them.the kick and floor were fine,so i added a tom i had,wrapped it all and sold it.
i have a first run acro welded seam that im restoring its a orange peal but is there proof on that drum i dont know is there any paper work on it ?
i sold a suppose pre proto type cos 3x 13 jazz snare with keystone and it did not list until 72 cat so no early on mention of it no proof i only only got 350 for it should of kept it but cant collect all the drums in the world
i have a first run acro welded seam that im restoring its a orange peal but is there proof on that drum i dont know is there any paper work on it ?
Rob Cook's Ludwig Book p246 mentions the welded seam on prototypes and has a photo of one which has all aluminum lugs and hoops. Do the other production details suggest yours is early 1963? or pre 1963? Or are you asking about the "orange peel" finish?
i sold a suppose pre proto type cos 3x 13 jazz snare with keystone and it did not list until 72 cat so no early on mention of it no proof i only only got 350 for it should of kept it but cant collect all the drums in the world
Those nice COS ones? It's called a Piccolo. Catalogs don't come out every year and they aren't always right up to date so production drums can appear for sale before they appear in a catalog. I see the metal Piccolo in the 1972 catalog and not in the 1967 catalog (looking at the Clay Greene scans). So all that tells me they came out some time in between. The aforementioned Rob Cook book says they came out in 1970 so a keystone badge would be an early one but not necessarily a prototype. Others may know more about that.
Here are instances I've recorded of a keystone one turning over in my database:
Ludwig 3x13 Metal Piccolo KS675787 pristine $512.00 11 bids eBay 20-Mar-08
Ludwig 3x13 Metal Piccolo KS482016 pristine hazelshould $615.00 17 bids eBay 29-Mar-08
Ludwig Piccolo 3x13 ks625402 $406.61 31 bids eBay 15-Feb-09
So your $350 may be a bit low, but not so bad if you sold it in the depths of the Global Financial Crisis or 10 years ago. It depends on context and the condition it was in.
I'm a bit suspicious that my serial number of 482016 may have been a data entry error. I'll go and crosscheck what I can to find out. It would certainly be a very early one! *** edit *** I'd be happier if it were 68 rather than 48, but I can't find anything to cross check...other than hazelshould is a good seller and he did seem sure that it was 1967.
happy Easter weekend to all
my acro has a big welded plate over the seam and it would be nice to find out if its early it has aluminum lugs it mite of came with the same rims when new but i got it without im putting the early cob rims on it its not done was this the famed orange peal anodized first run drum 404
A dealer tried to sell me DW/PDP prototypes a week or so ago- since nobody would let me look inside the shells or take off lugs to check for authenticity (as DW lugs are getting faked these days), I basically thought they were fakes. They did have a nice green glass sparkle finish, however. No badges, and I couldn't see inside the shells to check for authenticity. I guess I am just a jaded fellow...
Prototype cymbals- different story. Usually the word "prototype" is stamped on the cymbal. I have several Paiste Prototypes, usually code for "special order".
happy Easter weekend to all my acro has a big welded plate over the seam and it would be nice to find out if its early it has aluminum lugs it mite of came with the same rims when new but i got it without im putting the early cob rims on it its not done was this the famed orange peal anodized first run drum 404
Those prototype Acros had aluminum lugs and rims,not sure about the tension rods and strainer/butt.The original rims will be very tuff to find.The proof you seek is the fact that the shell is welded with a reinforcment plate over it.Only the proto acros should have the orange peel finish.The later acros introduced in the 64 catalog are one piece spun alumunum shelled (ludalloy)drums.Some protos i've seen had pre-serial keystone badges.
Steve B
Are there really prototype drums out there?Are they documented, and if so, how?Is this just a catch-all term we turn to when we have mixed hardware/badges/labels/shell types, etc. etc. during transition periods?One sees the term all over eBay, of course, but when I notice it on the drum forums, it raises some questions for me.Just curious?Anyone out there have some pics and supporting descriptions for their prototypes?
1. Tama Kenny Aronoff prototype, rejected by Kenny in favor of the John Aldridge-engraved models that followed.
2. 4x14, 5x14, 6.5x14 Lang/Gladstone/Aldridge engraved Gold Triumphal Model prototypes #1, 2, 3...(also engraved by John Aldridge.
These drums are in my book on pgs. 148-149 and 172-177.
Mike Curotto
