Builder vs Assembler. Difference?

One is a compliment and discription of one's craft, the other is meant as an insult.

This came up a long while ago during, of all things, an arguement (I've witnessed several over the years) between an established builder and a "customer" who was questioning why the builders drums were more expensive than his competetor's who was selling a kit at a lower price than the builder was. "Well he builds all his own drums, you just assemble drums from shells made by someone else." "He has custom lugs." (designed by that company but outsourced to India).

Customers don't know that every company outsources most of their materials and that little of their top dollar lines are actually made 100% inhouse. The term "custom" has been over used and blown out of proportion.

OK, I guess it's time for me to take the lure & head for the other end of the lake...i.e., bait received, bait taken.

Custom and/or Boutique are idiotic terms that customers expect to justify spending X amount of dollars on something that doesn't have DW, TAMA, Gretsch, etc on the side of them. These terms actually belittle the time & effort most builders spend delivering their goods. I build NuckelHead Drums...not Custom drums or Boutique drums...Custom is something the big boys use as a noun, not an adjective.

A drum builder being classified as a "drum assembler" because they don't build the shells is no different than calling drum restoration experts "cleaners" or carpenters being classified as a "house assemblers" just because he/she didn't cure & mill the 2x4's used in the infrastructure. Would you call Gretsch drum assemblers just because they used the Jasper Shells? What about DW when they started? Someone who builds great drums wants someone who builds great shells making their stuff. It is not all inclusive! The drum I built for Bunnyman took over a year in the finishing & curing process. The drum I built for Musicaldeath took 7 months. All edges & beds were hand cut & sanded & all the lugs floated in the interior of the shell structure to insure full shell resonance. Sorry bubba, that's not assembly.

Am I insulted? nope, everyone has their own opinion. I know what I do as a builder & so do my customers. Building is an art form!...when everything is said and done, I make about 50 cents an hour. It's a labor of love not money, but the seeds have been sown & I actually appreciate the exposure.

Dan - NuckelHead Drums

That was what I was trying to say about ford and chevy in the whole builder vs. assembler deBate. Your a smart guy for being a class clown lol

So then is vintage more 2k a drum cleaner? Is for and Chevy car assemblers? Is bunnyman a pole assembler?

you must have this forum mixed up with another forum? this discussion you speak of never took place on this forum? would you please post some of your custom drum work for all to see as I myself have and some others also have? also you are reading what you want to into this thread, I'm not makeing the judgment of the two you are. There certainly is a higher degree of skills needed from a true builders stand point than just an assemblier. So I guess then I'm a drum builder since I did Really perform all the labor. to turn the shell blank into a very good sounding musical instrument.

Unless he`s a funny bunny,..it`s poll !! stupy,..you`ll get id added on your own !!

So where does the split between drum manufacturer and builder lay ??

I`ts like a plant would have a foundry, and woodshop for raw materials, and then forgers and coopers, then there`s the plateing and painters, then there`s the assemblers, then only if it`s German there`s quality control, then there`s the marketing and retail department, then the reaserch and developement, all rolled up and put into it`s badge !! I guess if you use builder as an adverb and not a noun, you are that or like Yoda would say...that you are !!

Dan, for keeping this thread alive and not being tanked. I didn't state that if the drum builder does not build the shells, then that quantifies as a non builder. It was one of the examples that I used as a builder. But a real builder does all the necessary work on the shell blank to make it from a cylindrical piece of ply wood or a wood blank, Once again if you read this thread thoroughly, camco and rogers used the very same shells, but the two drums sound nothing alike due to what they Individually did with the shells..The drum I showed the Keller Vintage Mahogany shell. I spent more time on the finish work than I did on the actual drum making process, In fact it took One day to complete all the shell work on, that was cutting double 45 degree bearing edges top and bottom, and hand cutting the snare beds I drew out the shape on the shell using a radius gauge and Hand chiseled the wood out and hand shaped the radius of the bearing edges they both match perfectly and then hand polishing the bearing edges with heated 100% carnauba wax, if you have never worked with this stuff, it is not for the faint at heart!! hand polished the edges with 1800 grit steel mesh wool, the finish is a mixture of four different colored stains, mixed with violin varnish, carnauba wax, and tung oil all in one mixture. then hand polished with the 1800 grit steel mesh wool in between some of the applications and some not. I've also posted the link to where much of the materials and tools used for this job came from. Dan Please share some of the details of your Drum build. Please??Post pics of yourself performing the necessary skills to Build a drum, As a Drum Company it's free advertising to the public

Craviotto and Joyful Noise are custom drum builders. Dunett who attatched itself to them so he could appear like a builder is not. He picks up what they leave behind. Do some reading,its very clear and obvious. Builders are creative and break through the barrier. Wanna bees...are wanna bees. Some assemblers who are content with that are very humble and talented and accept the title.There are only a handful out there so do your homework,and check everyone out before you buy anything from them.

Wayne both Johnnie and Joyful noise are World Class for sure. I've ownd a Craviotto and it was stunning!

Not mixing up anything nor am I reading anything into this thread. We are discussing WORDS.

The "argument" took place in a face to face situations with friends who are drum builders and their potential customers.

Where did I make a judgement on anyone? I don't recall naming anyone or even referring to anyone in particular.

I offered my opinion of what the applied terms of "Builder" and "Assembler" mean to some people and how they are used to denigrate.

Sorry if you were offended by my opinion of the meanings of words.

.

I wasn't offended, I was only trying to get clarification from where this discussion came from you were not very clear on your opening post to that point.

Also this is your statement and I Quote. "I offered my opinion of what the applied terms of "Builder" and "Assembler" mean to some people and how they are used to denigrate" end of Quote..

I'm not making a judgment on either a builder or assembler then the choice of "words" you selected is a judgement to those terms. Personally myself I could careless either way .This is just a thread for this forum to give clarification to the two terms that all. Please post pics of your custom drum builds if you will. So It's been several days now and No photos of any projects, so the definition for you then is an instigator and a dictionary!! funny how that is. SO are you an expert in anything to do with any subject on this forum???? At least I have provided a few real examples of my work so yes I am an expert.