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  #11  
Old 02-15-2015, 12:35 AM
zenstat zenstat is offline
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Default Re: K Zildjian ISTANBUL 20" Sizzle / 1950's ???

Yes, final prices from eBay. Asking price isn't a very good estimator of what an item will actually go for. Of course, it is asking price which appears on places like Maxwells site...not the final price. I'm sure you know that. I can't tell if orangemi does.

There are several other codes which can appear under the Bids field to indicate other outcomes like: -3 best offer accepted but we don't know what it is (eBay quit giving that info), -2 reserve not met, -1 for when it was BINned, 0 for when nobody bid (hence it didn't sell).

All of my usual reporting is based on restricting an analysis to bids >= 1. All of this plus all the different coding details for every field are fully documented in the Codes tab of my spreadsheet. And of course, all my data is freely available on request. You don't have to take my word for anything. You can analyze it yourself.

Naturally I'm collecting all the different stamp eras, diameters, and hats as pairs. Same for old As, and the same for 602s and Sound Creations. With the 602/Sound Creations I have a data series which started in 2006 so it is possible to examine price changes over time. And as a happy circumstance the reissue 602s came out during this time so it is possible to see how they affected used prices. And the Global Financial Crisis is in there too.

In addition to eBay sales (worldwide as best I can) I pick up sales on CH and DFO (at least I'm starting to be more thorough about those) but not here. I have a feeling that quite a few people would list things in several places so I'd record some of them. I also pick up some CraigsList sales via CH when people post links to a CraigsList listing. But that source is much less reliable given I'm relying on others to both notice and bother to post on it. In the case of CH and DFO I only know the asking price because I'm not party to any private negotiation by Private Message. Since prices on the forums are a bit less than eBay I don't see this as much of a problem.

My coverage isn't a perfect reflection of the total used market because I don't see things for sale in local drum shops, for example, or at vintage drum shows and the like. But I don't know anybody else who has this sort of data actually recorded and makes it freely available. It seems a worthwhile project.
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For every expert, there is an equal and opposite expert, but for every fact there is not necessarily an equal and opposite fact (Thomas Sowell, 1995 in The Vision of the Anointed)

Paiste 602/Sound Creation research click here
Which K Stamp? A DIY tool click here
Old K prices and weights click here
Avedis Zildjian gallery and timeline click here
Old A prices and weights click here

Last edited by zenstat; 02-15-2015 at 03:06 AM. Reason: forgot to list my data sources
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  #12  
Old 09-20-2017, 09:12 AM
Hobbs Hobbs is offline
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Default Re: K Zildjian ISTANBUL 20" Sizzle / 1950's ???

Going to check out a 20" INTERMEDIATE stamp today. Buyer's asking $1200 - which I think is high.

Don't know weight; but looks great: no issues I can see in pics.

Amazing searching value on Istanbul INT. stamp cymbals : 20"s value LOWER than prior series ... but 18"'s value HIGHER!

Thoughts?

Chris
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  #13  
Old 09-20-2017, 06:23 PM
zenstat zenstat is offline
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Default Re: K Zildjian ISTANBUL 20" Sizzle / 1950's ???

Here are my up to date 20" prices (based on data through mid 2017). Asking $1200 is about 75% percentile in price. In other words 3 out of 4 fetch a lower price when they sell. For an individual cymbal (taking into account how it sounds, condition, and weight) that might be an ok price. But at least you have a bit more context now.

The up to date data shows the same pattern of pricing with Intermediates having an expected price range of around $600-$900.



No evidence of a significant price trend, over the years I've been tracking. This does need to be balanced out against the question "would we be able to detect a trend if prices were going up steadily at say 2% per year?" The other thing to note in the graph below is those circles up higher than the bulk of each year's sales. Those are "premium seller effect" prices which were discussed earlier on in this thread.



The biggest predictor of price is stamp era, but once you take that into account there is a smaller effect of weight. Lower weight tends to get a bit higher price.



As regards 18" vs 20" prices and stamp era, I'm not yet back to a more detailed comparison of possible reversal effects (or more accurately price interation effects) between stamp era and diameter. I've got more detailed model fitting to work on first, and some other projects as well. At least I've now got much more data so I can fit more sophisticated models. And so far the additional data shows that the preliminary results were robust.
__________________
For every expert, there is an equal and opposite expert, but for every fact there is not necessarily an equal and opposite fact (Thomas Sowell, 1995 in The Vision of the Anointed)

Paiste 602/Sound Creation research click here
Which K Stamp? A DIY tool click here
Old K prices and weights click here
Avedis Zildjian gallery and timeline click here
Old A prices and weights click here

Last edited by zenstat; 09-20-2017 at 07:18 PM. Reason: typos fixed I hate autocorrect
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  #14  
Old 09-20-2017, 09:30 PM
Hobbs Hobbs is offline
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Default Re: K Zildjian ISTANBUL 20" Sizzle / 1950's ???

Great information, Steve. Thank you for all the work compiling it all.

Chris
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'65 Ludwig Club Date Champagne Sparkle 12/JF/20 ~ Looking for 14" Floor Tom
'66 Ludwig Club Date Bronze Lacquer Mist 12/Pioneer/20 ~ Looking for 14" Club Date Floor Tom
YAMAHA Maple Custom NATURAL GLOSS 12/14/snare/18
Dynacord ADD-ONE + ADD-DRIVE
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