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  #21  
Old 12-07-2012, 04:25 PM
J!m J!m is offline
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Default Re: new "Vintage" cycmbals...

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Originally Posted by BosLover View Post
I would never suggest there are no good modern A's. I haven't heard them all of course. But, most of the ones I have heard just don't appeal to me, and many just sound awful to my ears. I can say pretty much the same for many modern K's as well, although I do like some of the k Cons very much. My son and I have a 22" K Con medium thin high, a 22" medium thin low, and a 22" Light, any of which we could live with as a main ride if we had to. We also have a very nice pair of 14" K Con hats which are dark and jazzy, but still cut very well in a big band situation and also works well for pop and light rock and country. But generally, other than these we avoid modern Zildjians. If I'm going to buy new or "modern", it's usually Bosphorus (no surprise there) or AGOP. In fact my son's favorite left side ride when he gigs is a 20" Bosphorus Hammer with 2 rivets. Thin, dark, and trashy with a very woody stick sound and great definition.
This is what I am reading about them, and that intrigues me for sure. I mean, all I have known intimately is the A's that I have. Sort of like growing up in a small town where you don't know what's out there until you get off the couch and check it out!

I have a feeling I can find some sweet ones if I dig deep enough, but there are not 'piles' of them around the usual suspects to dig through- other than at Zildjian... This plan is looking better and better, but I'm sure I would be paying full boat to walk in and get cymbals there... On the other hand, they'd be the best of what they have to offer (to my ears) and therefore probably worth every damn penny. I'd only need hats, a ride and a couple crashes.
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  #22  
Old 12-07-2012, 04:34 PM
BosLover BosLover is offline
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Default Re: new "Vintage" cycmbals...

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Originally Posted by J!m View Post
Used 80's vintage K's, same vintage as my A's. I am curious about these k constantinoples which is part of the driver for this thread in fact (those and the A Cie. ones). I just don't see them around much to try out, and never second hand (being cheap and all...).
Again, in the parlance of this site, American K's from the '80s are not generally thought of as vintage.

The K Con's are available. A new 22" K Con is far from cheap. They go for around $500 or more with a list price of around $900. Carrying them depends on the quality of your local drum shop and the type of clinical they serve. If they basically stock lower end or entry level drums, they probably won't carry many K cons.
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  #23  
Old 12-07-2012, 04:53 PM
J!m J!m is offline
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Default Re: new "Vintage" cycmbals...

i have one 'real' drum shop near me (Dynamic Percussion) but Art Benson (a friend of mine) does not own it any longer. Art's store was 5-star and he had (or could get) whatever you needed and was always competitive with the pricing. The new guy? He's fine but it's not the shop it was for sure.

Then there is Sam Ass and Guitar Splinter. They actually carry some decent drums (DW Collectors, Yamaha whatever, but not PHX of course) and their cymbal selection is not horrible usually. I stopped in Sam Ass in Long Island yesterday (was back to the main plant for a few hours) and they had K Cons and A Cie. in stock but I did not have the time to give them a fair shake. They also have a very sweet 20-12-14-sn Rodgers silver sparkle holiday kit for just shy of two grand... But that is another topic.

Anyway, I THINK the A Cie. line might be a good fit for me, but when/if I get to Zildjian I am going to work with someone (mid-week, mid-day to get the attention I want) and really find out exactly what I want for a "new" sound for me. With them so close, I'm a fool not to exploit that resource. I have a drummer friend who also wants to check it out, so it should be a fun day.
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Cobalt Blue Yamaha Recording Custom 20b-22b-8-10-12-13-15-16f-18f
Red Ripple '70's Yamaha D-20 20b-12-14f
Piano Black Yamaha Recording Custom Be-Bop kit 18b-10-14f
Snares:
Yamaha COS SDM5; Yamaha Cobalt Blue RC 5-1/2x14; Gretsch round badge WMP; 1972 Ludwig Acrolite; 1978 Ludwig Super Sensitive; Cobalt Blue one-off Montineri; Yamaha Oak (6X13!); DW collectors 5-1/2X14 maple; cheap 3.5X13 brass piccolo
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  #24  
Old 12-07-2012, 05:18 PM
Rik_Everglade Rik_Everglade is offline
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Default Re: new "Vintage" cycmbals...

I have K constantinople in 13 hats, 16, 17, 18 crash, 20 flat, 19 c/r, 12 splash, and a home made 5 inch splash from a trimmed down cracked 16. I absolutely love the sound of these cymbals. Don't buy them. I'd like to keep these sounds as "my" sound. I have a whole set of K cymbals that I'm going to try and trade/sell on this site, just haven't gotten around to it. I like the sound of the K, but since I've gotten the K constantinoples, I don't even take them down from my cymbal wall. Every once in a while I hear a cymbal that I do like more than mine, but they are usually the odd cymbal out in another manufacturer's range of cymbals. As a whole, this range of K cons sound great together.
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  #25  
Old 12-07-2012, 06:08 PM
J!m J!m is offline
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Default Re: new "Vintage" cycmbals...

Well, at the moment Rik you have nothing to fear!

But, you never know what may happen in the future with me...
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Red Ripple '70's Yamaha D-20 20b-12-14f
Piano Black Yamaha Recording Custom Be-Bop kit 18b-10-14f
Snares:
Yamaha COS SDM5; Yamaha Cobalt Blue RC 5-1/2x14; Gretsch round badge WMP; 1972 Ludwig Acrolite; 1978 Ludwig Super Sensitive; Cobalt Blue one-off Montineri; Yamaha Oak (6X13!); DW collectors 5-1/2X14 maple; cheap 3.5X13 brass piccolo
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  #26  
Old 12-07-2012, 06:24 PM
Rik_Everglade Rik_Everglade is offline
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Default Re: new "Vintage" cycmbals...

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Originally Posted by J!m View Post
Well, at the moment Rik you have nothing to fear!

But, you never know what may happen in the future with me...
I hope you are wildly successful at drumming someday, and remember that there's this dreamer out there trying to make it too!
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  #27  
Old 12-07-2012, 06:38 PM
J!m J!m is offline
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Default Re: new "Vintage" cycmbals...

Well, I've been waiting for about 37 years for that to happen...
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Cobalt Blue Yamaha Recording Custom 20b-22b-8-10-12-13-15-16f-18f
Red Ripple '70's Yamaha D-20 20b-12-14f
Piano Black Yamaha Recording Custom Be-Bop kit 18b-10-14f
Snares:
Yamaha COS SDM5; Yamaha Cobalt Blue RC 5-1/2x14; Gretsch round badge WMP; 1972 Ludwig Acrolite; 1978 Ludwig Super Sensitive; Cobalt Blue one-off Montineri; Yamaha Oak (6X13!); DW collectors 5-1/2X14 maple; cheap 3.5X13 brass piccolo
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  #28  
Old 12-08-2012, 07:16 PM
SlingerLynn SlingerLynn is offline
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Default Re: new "Vintage" cycmbals...

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Originally Posted by J!m View Post
And this brings up an intereting point: If you had five old K Cons (the real ones) all 17 inch and all the same weight (within 10-20 grams) I think those would also sound quite wildly different. Don't you think? Or were the hand hammered ones really that consistent? I have to imagine that despite the variance in your example above, that has to be far more consistent than the 'old days'...
I'm quite sure they would sound different due to the nature of being entirely handmade.

Quote:
Originally Posted by J!m View Post
I stopped in Sam Ass in Long Island yesterday (was back to the main plant for a few hours) and they had K Cons and A Cie. in stock but I did not have the time to give them a fair shake.
You better jump at those A & Cie's quick if you like them. The word is they have been discontinued.

I hope you find what you're looking for!
Lynn
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1945 Slingerland RK sparkling gold pearl 26/13/14/16/early 50s 5.5x14 Krupa RK
1967 Slingerland green glass glitter 20/12/14/Hollywood Ace
60s Slingerland 24/13/16/7x14 project
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  #29  
Old 12-09-2012, 09:06 AM
J!m J!m is offline
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Default Re: new "Vintage" cycmbals...

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Originally Posted by SlingerLynn View Post
You better jump at those A & Cie's quick if you like them. The word is they have been discontinued.

I hope you find what you're looking for!
Lynn
Thank you Lynn, Me too.

As cymbals are cymbals, I won't know what I want, until I hear it. Maybe it will be a vintage piece, maybe it will be some of the 'new' vintage stuff.

I always keep my eyes peeled for those 80's vintage A's because I am familiar with them. I agree some can be gongy, clangy, too metallic, or all of the above (18" rock crash anyone??). Thin is good; paper thin is better. However I play new beats and I run them upside down so the heavy cymbal is on top- I have since I got these new, so go figure!

I just feel that something 'different' for this old kit I'm working on would be more appropriate. I can always use whatever cymbals I have, depending on the venue and music type (I have more than enough for two kits); however I want the option of a very different sound to compliment the old kit when I feel that is appropriate. BUT, A different sound I relate to somehow...
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Cobalt Blue Yamaha Recording Custom 20b-22b-8-10-12-13-15-16f-18f
Red Ripple '70's Yamaha D-20 20b-12-14f
Piano Black Yamaha Recording Custom Be-Bop kit 18b-10-14f
Snares:
Yamaha COS SDM5; Yamaha Cobalt Blue RC 5-1/2x14; Gretsch round badge WMP; 1972 Ludwig Acrolite; 1978 Ludwig Super Sensitive; Cobalt Blue one-off Montineri; Yamaha Oak (6X13!); DW collectors 5-1/2X14 maple; cheap 3.5X13 brass piccolo
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  #30  
Old 12-09-2012, 08:28 PM
zenstat zenstat is offline
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Default Re: new "Vintage" cycmbals...

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Originally Posted by SlingerLynn View Post
You better jump at those A & Cie's quick if you like them. The word is they have been discontinued.
The further word is that A & Cie were discontinued some years ago when the Armand series came out. Later they reappeared for one year (I can't remember which: 2010?) in the Rarities program. Some shops still have them in stock.

A & Cie were trying to recreate the late 40s 50s vibe. I've just gone and bought some A Zildjians of that era rather than chase A & Cie.

Armands are trying to recreate the 60s vibe. You can usually find real 60s Zidljians cheaper. I certainly have, and I live at the end of the supply line. Yes real 60s ones aren't as shiny.
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