Slingerland tom mount and shell query.

[aldrums01]

Hi and congratulations on a great site!
I bought this Slingerland kit recently sizes 20,13,16 in Champagne sparkle unfortunately with no snare. As you can see from the photos the covering is in good condition for its age (serial 165xxx- 1967/69 approx. from Dr.CJW's serial no.graph).
The kick drum has been drilled to fit a tom mount prior to the one that is on there now. I've looked for pictures of kits of similar vintage and they all seem to have the traditional 'rail' style tom mount,which i thought was on mine originally but there is no sign of the holes to fit that style of mount.
So I'm wondering if I actually have the original tom mount on there now, put back on the kick after it was 'butchered' as the attachment on the 13" tom looks like it may be original also.
Also the inner ply in the kick drum seems to have split, not from being misused but I think its from the factory? Any suggestion to stop it from getting worse? Could you tell me what these shells are made from, if its any clue there is a 'p' printed inside all 3 shells.
Just so we're all clear on it.... they sound fantastic despite these faults and I'm so happy these have found a home at my place......

[DrCJW]

aldrums01:

Post some pictures and we'll be happy to sleuth the tom mount issue.

Same with the interior ply. Interior ply splitting is not all that uncommon - it often occurs due to the shell being subjected to moisture - high humidity, a damp basement etc, as well as cold. The ply bond separates just a bit, the ply expands and contracts, and a split forms. And then occasionally the ply develops a split shortly after coming out of the shell former at the factory - this is more rare. The good news is that whatever the reason, a split in the interior ply is usually not a big concern. Often, unless there is some ply lifting, the split can just be left alone. Alternatively, it the crack is hairline or modest you can use some Elmers wood glue - it will soak into the crack by capillary action and bond up nicely. For your interiors, assuming they are weak chocolate milk stained, there is a matching shade of Elmers commonly available. Soak a modest amount in, immediately wipe off the excess. Apply more than once if desired. If you have clear interiors (not likely on your drums at that serial number if black & brass badges) get the lighter wood shade Elmers.

Again, assuming black & brass badges serials 165xxx or so, your drums are thin mahogany outer ply under the Champagne pearl, thick poplar middle ply, thin maple interior ply with solid maple reinforcing rings. You probably have the weak chocolate milk stained interiors. The stamped P was used to signify that the shell was chosen to be "Pearl" wrapped.

[aldrums01]

Hi Doc.
Sorry about the delay, had to learn about jpeg compression.....

I also should let you know that the serial no. is 197xxx on all 3 drums and not 165xxx as I previously informed you.. Would the shells be of the same composition?

Also the badge on the kick drum is what I would consider to be upside down, (that is from the playing position). Its not a problem to me just a little strange as I think i might be playing the drum the wrong way round? That is however the way the kick drum legs tilt the drum to be played, so I've just left it like that.

And as for the tom mount, the tom sits perfectly on it but the extra 4 drill holes on the kick have confused me, plus also the fact it's a double tom mount also tells me its not original. I've done a few gigs with it and it sounds beautiful but I'm using a snare stand to mount the tom...

Any feedback would be great, I'll send more photos if you need them, I'm only allowed 5 at a time....

thanks again Al....

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[DrCJW]

aldrums01:

You have a retrofit non-Slingerland tom mount on there now. Your drums were made in 1968, and the original tom was the aluminum Set-O-Matic. It occupied the four holes you see around your wrong tom mount. Slingerland placed the badge so that it could be read from the audience side. So the top of your bass drum originally looked as shown below in the attached pictures. In addition to the picture of a correct 1968 Champagne bass drum mounting there is a picture that shows a complete 1968 aluminum single Set-O-Matic bass plate, arm and tom plate.

Your tom has a diamond plate for a clip mount, which appears compatible with the wrong mount you currently have. The hole fastening pattern for the diamond clip mount is the same as for the Set-O-Matic, so a plate for a rail mount on a Set-O-Matic tom will fit. Check underneath the plate or inside the tom to see if there is a large shell hole in the middle of the fastening hole pattern. This would be for the Set-O-Matic arm that inserted into the shell interior as shown below.

The interior of your bass drum is factory correct for 1968, with the weak chocolate milk stain over the maple interior. Your shell is as I described above - 3-ply maple-poplar-mahogany with solid maple reinforcing rings.

[aldrums01]

Thanks again Dr.CJW.
I have seen this type of tom mount recently on e-bay and I will ask the guy I bought the kit from if he still might have the original mount stored away somewhere.
I want to restore it to as original as possible but I have my doubts on the reliability of this type of 'ball' style mount as I've had previous trouble with both Yamaha and Remo tom mounts in the past that employ this ball style mount.
My guess is that original mount probably broke and they replaced it with this mount because it has been taken care of pretty well for a kit this age. By the way I removed the internal plate in the tom to reveal the hole you mentioned.(well done).
The reason i say he may still have the original mount is that he has dug around his house and found the snare for me, I don't know what it is or what condition it is in but fingers crossed its a radio king....i should be so lucky.
I'll post some pictures as soon as I get it.
Here are some more photos I took that didn't fit on my first posting.
thanks again.
Al.

[69OysterBlue]

Ladies and Gents -

This is my first posting on Vintage Drum Forum, so I apologize up front if my question has already been covered in detail long before my arrival here.

My question has to do with Slingerland Tom Mount hardware. I have owned a Ludwig kit since I purchased it new in January 1969, so that is all I have known in my drumming experience.

This past weekend I purchased a very nice 4 piece Slingerland kit w/ Black over Brass badges (circa 1966?) in excellent condition. I had never seen the Set-O-Matic mouting hardware before, but now it appears that I own it! The ball pivot thing seemed a little weird at first, but it really does seem to work quite well and is more stable than I would have imagined.

I have two questions -

First of all, is there any way to adapt the single rack tom set up to a dual rack tom configuration using this Set-O-Matic hardware? On one hand I would like to keep this kit in it's original configuration, but I am also tempted to expand/enhance this kit if I could find a mid 60's 8x12 Blue Sparkle Pearl tom.

Secondly, how tough is it to find replacement parts for the Set-O-Matic hardware? My new (old) kit seems to work OK but both the verticle shaft (with the ball on it) and the horizontal shaft (extending into the tom) show some serious screw indentations from where this kit has been adjusted over the years. I would love to get a clean version of this tom mount hardware to bring this kit back to original condition.

Any advice you can offer would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks!

[vadrums]

The mount on your bass drum is a Ludwig "Standard" line model...

[Jaye]

69Oyster...can you add a pic or two ?

I believe the set-o-matic system had either tom arms for one tom, or a double rack tom configuration. So...you would ned to find a set-o-matic tom arm for double rack toms. Thy come up on eay fairly often..but they don't go too cheap...probably expect on spending $50 or so...you can also post in the "wanted" section here.

[69OysterBlue]

Here is a picture of the kit I purchased (if I did the upload a picture thing correclty).

Hopefully you can get a decent look at the tom mount.

Thanks for any advice you might be able to offer.

[Jaye]

Duuude...fookin' gorgeous kit ! Wow, congrats on owning it !

Yes...you just need to get a set-o-matic tom post with a double-mount system. Here...or eBay.....

[69OysterBlue]

Thanks for the comment - I think these drums look pretty awesome as well!

I am still struggling with whether or not I should keep them in their original configuration (for the sake of collector value) or beef this kit up with another rack tom for the fun of playing it the way I am used to.

Let me know what you think.

[Jaye]

Well...on the one hand, one can say...go ahead and challenge yourself with the 4-pc. kit...it will make you play a bit differently and I always feel that getting minimal improves one's playing over time.

On the other hand...if you landed a double-mount, and then either landed a 13" blue rack or just bought an orphan and rewrapped it...you could have the rig you are used to. You would certainly keep the original single tom arm stored somewhere, so it's not as if you'd be messin' with the original factory 4-pc. kit at all. Just don't go losing or selling the single tom arm....

[Rich K.]

[QUOTE=aldrums01;2250]Hi Doc.
Sorry about the delay, had to learn about jpeg compression.....

Pretty sure that's a '60s Gretsch tom on your bass drum.

[Rich K.]

Thanks for the comment - I think these drums look pretty awesome as well!

I am still struggling with whether or not I should keep them in their original configuration (for the sake of collector value) or beef this kit up with another rack tom for the fun of playing it the way I am used to.

Let me know what you think.
There are a few easy ways to make your set a double tom set without sacrificing originality (permanently).
1. You can buy (from ebay, or drum forums) the setomatic double stubby thing seen here.
http://cgi.ebay.com/Slingerland-1975-Black-Chrome-22-16-13-12-99-95-NR_W0QQitemZ250367508039QQihZ015QQcategoryZ10175QQ ssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
It the top piece retrofits your single arm...just don't misplace your stuff when you do that. This was pretty standard for Slingerland in the '70s. They've become pretty unpopular because the tom positioning is real limited...tilt the right tom up, the left goes down...
2. You could spend a lot more on a later Super setomatic mount which will also fit on the ball you have. It works well, but finding what you'll need (the big "block" and another single arm) will cost a bit.
Here's the "block" part...that goes on the ball and then you put a single arm in each small hole...
http://cgi.ebay.com/Slingerland-Super-set-o-matic-Tom-Mount-Parts-Project_W0QQitemZ250367229330QQihZ015QQcategoryZ47 089QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
2 easier, cheaper and more flexible ways would be to either put one tom on a snare stand...put the first tom on the stand and use the arm for the second tom, OR, put a RIMS type thing on the extra tom, and hang it with a multi clamp from a cymbal arm.

[Ninefingers]

Good advice. You would never get the fade of the original wrap to match, probably. But, you could find one that's close enough. I love those wraps.