Ludwigs with a red badge?

[gn86]

Hi everyone.
Just saw an add for some "junk" someone was giving away for around 100$ I noticed that the bass drum and some of the toms had ludwig lugs so I phoned him up and he didnt know **** about drums. I managed to squeeze enough info out of him to buy it.. I'm gonna go there on saturday to pick them up but I still don't know what it is..

There's a 16" floor, a 14" concert tom, a small 8" concert tom and a 20" bass.. All with black panther wrap, BUT according to the seller they got a red badge or something like that.. All info he could give me was "it says ludwig here, and it's red" Nothing more.. just ludwig.. in red.. according to him they have re-rings..

This is gonna be alot of fun to see what it is.. What do you think? Did ludwig ever use a red badge?
btw. the kit included some real junk.. like a wesper tom, a maxwin snare, some cymbals (can't wait to see what those are), some hardware, a couple of pedals and a mapex mars pro tom (?)..

[jonnistix]

Red badge...hmm...seems I have seen this before. Also, they could be a very weathered keystone badge, as they are 3 ply, and he could be really color-blind. Did you venture into the realm of asking this farmer for a picture or two...? They could also have been hand painted, colored with a marker, no telling what happened...it is at least 30 years old...being 3 ply shells.
Hi everyone.
Just saw an add for some "junk" someone was giving away for around 100$ I noticed that the bass drum and some of the toms had ludwig lugs so I phoned him up and he didnt know **** about drums. I managed to squeeze enough info out of him to buy it.. I'm gonna go there on saturday to pick them up but I still don't know what it is..

There's a 16" floor, a 14" concert tom, a small 8" concert tom and a 20" bass.. All with black panther wrap, BUT according to the seller they got a red badge or something like that.. All info he could give me was "it says ludwig here, and it's red" Nothing more.. just ludwig.. in red.. according to him they have re-rings..

This is gonna be alot of fun to see what it is.. What do you think? Did ludwig ever use a red badge?
btw. the kit included some real junk.. like a wesper tom, a maxwin snare, some cymbals (can't wait to see what those are), some hardware, a couple of pedals and a mapex mars pro tom (?)..

[Ludwig-dude]

Ludwig did use a red badge but it was limited to use on the 1990's import rocker series drums. chances are he's either mistaken or something hoakey going on there....

[gn86]

I've attached some pics Ive just received.. I dont know what these are! Those lugs looks japanese.. and those red ludwig "badges" looks handmade.. Im very sceptical. what do you think?

[mcjnic]

Amazingly out of focus.

[Ludwig-dude]

Those aren't Ludwig. They are Maxwin....a Pearl stencil kit from the 70's. Stay away...far far away....lol!

[O-Lugs]

In addition to them being a stencil kit, they also have the name "Ludwig" stenciled onto the wrap (nice touch, huh?) Mister T

They are no good. Stay away.

[kevins]

In addition to them being a stencil kit, they also have the name "Ludwig" stenciled onto the wrap (nice touch, huh?) Mister T

They are no good. Stay away.

DOHLoLoLoLoLaughing Hcrying2-07

[kevmugen71]

Those aren't Ludwig. They are Maxwin....a Pearl stencil kit from the 70's. Stay away...far far away....lol!



Yes, you all stay far, far away, so us poor people can turn them into pure gold. flowers2 Let the flaming commence Soap Box lol

[john rutsey]

the very small concert tom appears to have rocker lugs. the tom in the back is not a maxwin it looks like a premier or maybe yamaha?

[kevmugen71]

Agreed, the tom in the back looks very Premier'ish. But the badge is so blurry when i zoom in I can't make it out. It looks to be a square black badge with gold or silver script. Hmmmm

[atomicmorganic]

Hey.100 bucks.

[jonnistix]

For the bass, it is a Star, and the floor tom is as well, not sure of the rest, but all oif the Slingerland lugs are actually Star. The tom in the back is a Pearl Export. The mount plate on the bas is Ludwig tho....

[wayne]

Reminds me when i hustled over to see a Gretsch kit for 200 bucks only to find the guy traced the logo on a cheap nameless head...Yes,i ripped him a new one!!

[jonnistix]

Those aren't Ludwig. They are Maxwin....a Pearl stencil kit from the 70's. Stay away...far far away....lol!
NOT MAxwin, the head is, but the rest is a Star 3 ply shell. Those lugs are most certainly Star. I have a ton of them. The tom in the back is a Pearl Export. Most of these are Star, so the three ply shells are, IMHO, better sounding than the thicker ones. It could make you a good knock about kit if you work them over a bit. They have that low booming resonance so few drums have. Go give them a listen, you might find a kit that could be a gigging kit for cheap.

[teverson-sr]

Regardless of what they really are,it is $100 worth of stuff.One of the floor toms has staggered lugs-cool.And it looks like a legit snare stand and possibly hi-hat stand in the background.I drove into Boston once to look at a "Tama"set for $250.Ended up being a generic with two Rockstar high toms.The father was selling them and knew little to nothing about them.Was probably worth $250-but not to me.I'd pay $100 for an MIJ w/staggered lugs.

[Ludwig-dude]

Its about $20 worth of firewood if you ask me... :p

[john rutsey]

ive never seen a pearl export with those lugs. dosent look like a pearl badge either.

[Kona]

$100.........if they can be at all playable...........it's worth it - imo. Even if you could make a really crappy set of drums yourself the materials would cost a heck of a lot more than that. I'm no expert.......just sayin..Keep on Pl

[jonnistix]

ive never seen a pearl export with those lugs. dosent look like a pearl badge either.
I stand corrected oin the tom with the "high-tension" lugs, they are not the Pearls.
Tom-the staggered lugs are Star. I have a complete set of Majestics with the staggered lugs, bass, toms and floor toms. I have both 14 and 16 right now for the blue sparkle. So it is 20-12-12-14-16 and matching snare. I have an offer on it right now, and if the offeree doesn't hustle, I m ay decide to keep them as an oddity. The 14, regardless, will stay here. The Star bass lugs have that ridge on the top, almost like a Hoshino "shark tooth" lug.

[gn86]

yeah. the mystery is solved.. With the blurry pics he had in the add the bass and floor toms looked like they had ludwig lugs and the wrap looked like black panther, the wrap is similair to black panther but it isnt.. anyways. I know it's some crap but I got alot of it for very little money.. 14, 16, 20 random vintage japanese crap.. 10" mapex mars tom, random wesper tom.. some random cheapo snare.. hardware and some cymbals (still don't know what those are, will get back on that)..

Anyways, there's only one thing that's confusing me at this point.. did they use 8 lugs/side on the 20"-ers? That bass is 20" according to the seller and usually cheaper drums had 6 lugs/side..

[MIKEY777]

yeah. the mystery is solved.. With the blurry pics he had in the add the bass and floor toms looked like they had ludwig lugs and the wrap looked like black panther, the wrap is similair to black panther but it isnt.. anyways. I know it's some crap but I got alot of it for very little money.. 14, 16, 20 random vintage japanese crap.. 10" mapex mars tom, random wesper tom.. some random cheapo snare.. hardware and some cymbals (still don't know what those are, will get back on that)..

Anyways, there's only one thing that's confusing me at this point.. did they use 8 lugs/side on the 20"-ers? That bass is 20" according to the seller and usually cheaper drums had 6 lugs/side..
This is what i see..The tom in back with the long lug's look's to be mapex...The bass and floor tom on right look to be star [[1960's]]--floor tom on left[[1970's]] pearl copy mmaxwin or something like that look to be a 5 to 8 ply shell..Oh on the 20" bass and yes star did used 8 lug's per a side...Mikey

[jonnistix]

yeah. the mystery is solved.. I know it's some crap but I got alot of it for very little money.. 14, 16, 20 random vintage japanese crap...hardware and some cymbals (still don't know what those are, will get back on that)..

Anyways, there's only one thing that's confusing me at this point.. did they use 8 lugs/side on the 20"-ers? That bass is 20" according to the seller and usually cheaper drums had 6 lugs/side..
Look, some of these older shells are very surprising. Just because they are "cheap" does not mean they are totally crap. Take some time on those shells. Clean them up, put some of your favorite heads on them and give them a go. I am talking about the Star Slingy copies, the thin shelled ones. Use a set of heads off some of your current set up to see if you can hear the tonal difference in them. After you have given them a fair shake, let us know what you find.
My bet is you will be very surprised. I am not joking about this, you may find a nice little gigging kit in them. Just use an Acrolite, you then won't have to expose your American drums to the harsh environment of the gigging scene, or you may find them to be really great in the studio. People are asking to use my 3 ply drums for recording because they have never heard a more mellowed, deep and powerful tone like them. Nothing else sounds like them. Just like the differences between Luds and Slings, Rogers and Gretsch...they have a wonderfully unique character. Do yourself a favor and try to have an open mind until proven correct...you may find a new friend.
Now, the 8 luggers are much better kits as they more tunable. These are the ones I love.

[gn86]

yeah, Im gonna try them out..
What kinda wood did they use in those old star-shells?

[gn86]

Okay. Here are the correct answers.. This was an odd bunch of drums

the drums were covered in black velvet...
The bass drum is a 20X14 star (or other japanese brand).. there's a gorgeous yellowed white marin pearl underneath that Im currently bringing to daylight once again.

The "floor toms" were actually 13" and a 12" pearl toms.. These are actually standard sized toms and someone have stacked another tom underneatch them "welding" the two together making these very deep.. Odd drums indeed and they are wrapped in blackvelvet aswell.. These will probably go to the bin..

The other toms were no mystery really.. a black 10" mapex tom and a blue wesper tom.. the cymbals that came with the kit was utter crap.. unfortunatly a trashed paiste 2002 crash was included.. but this one is cracked everywhere.. might be able to use it for something though.

[teverson-sr]

So did they take 2-13" drums and sleeve them together with a 12"?And then glue it all together?Hence the staggered lugs?Fascinating,Jim.....I'm using the 12X13 on my Rockstar set as a floor tom,along with the 16".It's the only way to get those "power"toms down low enough to play practically.And the 11X12 on a stand.Black velvet pearl-SHEXXAY......

[jonnistix]

yeah, Im gonna try them out..
What kinda wood did they use in those old star-shells?
This bass is a 3 ply mahog, and it is a Star, I can tell by the lugs. Please, play it before you toss aside. You will be very impressed with the low woody tone. Sand the edges smooth, leave them rounded over and it will boom like a cannon.
Also, the hoop looks like it has a grey marine pearl inlay...if it is, that is one hard to find puppy and I'm sure sxomeone would give a pretty penny for it to complete a restoration.

[gn86]

not really.. Im gonna post pics later on cause the toms are real madness.. It looks like they had a 13X9 and a 12X8.. Then took some shorter 13" and 12" and stacked them on the other shells, making these 13X13 and 12X13.. Very deep.. That's why the lugs on the 13" is offset.. And then the guy wrapped them in black velvet..
Im surprised that some jackass spent time doing this.. brings stupidity to a new level..

Regarding the bass drum, that one was the only thing with this kit that was worth the trip to pic them up.. the snare stand was nice too though.. Im gonna try it out.. it looks nice so I bet it will sound good.. btw.. does anyone know if there's any yellowed marin pearl wrap avaible anywhere? All new ones Ive seen are way too white.

[kevmugen71]

Im surprised that some jackass spent time doing this.. brings stupidity to a new level..

Laughing H

[Pounder]

The really small concert tom has a Pearl clip mount on it, and it appears to be a Pearl Fiberglass tom. That's from the picture though, which has limited visibility. Nothing replaces grabbing them and looking at them close range.

[jonnistix]

No wrap that color, unless you get in touch with Jaye. He has a chart that you can pick from all the colors and they will match you up. He can give you the details on how to get it ordered.
not really.. Im gonna post pics later on cause the toms are real madness.. It looks like they had a 13X9 and a 12X8.. Then took some shorter 13" and 12" and stacked them on the other shells, making these 13X13 and 12X13.. Very deep.. That's why the lugs on the 13" is offset.. And then the guy wrapped them in black velvet..
Im surprised that some jackass spent time doing this.. brings stupidity to a new level..

Regarding the bass drum, that one was the only thing with this kit that was worth the trip to pic them up.. the snare stand was nice too though.. Im gonna try it out.. it looks nice so I bet it will sound good.. btw.. does anyone know if there's any yellowed marin pearl wrap avaible anywhere? All new ones Ive seen are way too white.