LUDWIG 100th ANNIVERSARY SNARE DRUMS

[OldSchool]

Just wondering what the opinions are of the limited edition (?) snare drums that Ludwig distributed to celebrate its 100th Anniversary?

Are these currently considered collectibles or do you believe that they'll be considered so in the future?

Would you anticipate that these would be considered good investment pieces or simply novelties?Hmmmm

[Ludwig-dude]

I would think that they would be considered a future collectible, especially if it was in a numbered limited edition series.

[O-Lugs]

I think anything that was built to be collectible will probably not be as sought after as the things that won't (or can't) be built anymore. Thus, buying a tribute drum or an anniversary commemorative drum, etc., is kind of like buying a trophy as opposed to uncovering lost treasure.

[Ludwig-dude]

I think anything that was built to be collectible will probably not be as sought after as the things that won't (or can't) be built anymore. Thus, buying a tribute drum or an anniversary commemorative drum, etc., is kind of like buying a trophy as opposed to uncovering lost treasure.

I disagree....the Ludwig 75th anniversary drumkits are extremely rare, and when one pops up they command a hefty price, same with the 90th anniversary snare drums.

[O-Lugs]

Well, you asked for opinions about the 100th anniversary snare drums and that was mine. I can't predict the future, but it is my belief that there are different levels of collecting. The collectors who collect things that were made to be collected are not treasure hunter type collectors. It's like Beenie Babies and Franklin Mint coins -except much more expensive!

[Randydrummer]

All 100th Anniversary drums will be collectible...especially the high end ones.

I am a Ludwig artist and have spoke with the company about these drums. This past years NAMM show was buzzing about these drums. If you get the chance to pick one up...do. Not to mention they are incredible sounding. If you can get one of the hand engraved drums, you will not be disappointed.

Even the Black Magic laser engraved Anniversary drums are unreal!

[O-Lugs]

Wait a minute....We're talking about those gold drums that were made in Italy by German (or was it made in Germany by an Italian?) engraved and cost like 50 billion dollars, right? Or, is there some other model that I'm misunderstanding?


I guess, in a way, I can see it happening that these would be collectible....but not in the same sense of collecting that I'm referring to. I mean, it's kind of smart marketing to price these things into the stratosphere, because it will be a reference point for future value. In other words, I don't think those drums will ever increase in value over time but they will be collectible because they were so expensive when they were made.

[Randydrummer]

Your speaking of the Gold Triumphal Snare.

Yeah that drum is crazy. Just touching it will make you feel woozy!

Ludwig has produced the 100th Anniversary Snares.

http://www.ludwig-drums.com/

[O-Lugs]

Right! That's the one! That;s a gorgeous snare drum, man. But it's like the Golden Fleece. It's one of those "just for looking" drums. I imagine if it were to be set up with calfskin heads and old style snares, it would likely sound like....well...an old snare drum! I guess I would get more enjoyment out of looking at Mike Curotto's book of snare drum pictures than I would to spend that kind of moolah on what amounts to, basically, a sculpture of a functioning snare drum! :)

The way I collect things is that I set out on treasure hunts. I try to find the things that I want, but that other people don't want. I can get the good price and then that way, I can continue to collect! :p It isn't the same in my mind to put my order in and dish out the money for something that anyone else (who can afford it) can attain just as easily. Like I say, to me, it's like buying a trophy at the trophy store. It's not for me....unless I find one at an estate sale for no more than a few hundred dollars! I'll let you know when that happens! heh heh:Santa:

But, as a general rule, I stray away from the "made to be collectible" items.

[Mike Curotto]

L & L 25 yr. (Silver Anniversary, 1935-36) Black Beauties of which there are only 5 known (at the moment) have gone for 12000.00 to 27,000.00 in the last 3-5 yrs....I believe the 100th Anniversary Gold Triumphal of which only 50 of the projected 100 were produced will be a very valuable heirloom piece....if you have the dough then get one...there are two on eBay at this time...#1911 for 10,000.00+ and #1922 for 7500.00....7500.00 is a good price as the dealer cost is not far below that....

Mike Curotto

[Ludwig-dude]

Then of course there's the 100th anniversary "The CHeif" model as well....

I still say that these are future collectibles...why? Because they are of a limited run. Check out the prices of the 90th anniversary tophat & cane snare drums if you don't believe me. There were only 90 of them made after all......

[Randydrummer]

I agree. That drum is phenomenal. The painstaking thought and craftsmanship put into making the drum is ridiculous. That being said....consider that drum a serious investment. If you can live long enough to see your investment grow. I think about that drum the same I would good stocks. Imagine if you would have bought IBM stocks 50 years ago. This drum will surely be a investment.

Like I said before...it will take your breath away.

[caddywumpus]

I was bummed out that the 100th anniversary Jazz Festival wasn't a 3-ply with re-rings drum. THAT was a bummer...

[OldSchool]

I appreciate all the feedback on this topic to date. Feel free to keep it coming!

No-one's mentioned the 100th Anniversary pink oyster snare, which seems to be priced at a value that the "common" man might actually be able to afford. Would this particular snare be worth considering?

[O-Lugs]

I have a friend who has a LOT of money and he collects old archtop guitars. Some of the prices he has paid are off the scale of reality -TO ME. But, to him, he can't spend all the money he has if he tries to. I suppose for him, a drum like the Triumphal model would be just another nice shiny object. No matter what the market does, it wouldn't matter to him because he doesn't consider things like investment value. He just wants it and gets it without any bickering about the price. Nice, huh?

But, for me, being that I have lived the life of a jazz drummer for so long, these ways of spending money are not applicable. I consider every penny. I invest in collecting only in the things that I pretty much know will be worth more tomorrow than they are today. I'm not doing it as a get rich scheme. I just do it because it's easier on my mind knowing that I won't lose my money as time goes by. And converting the money into drums is...more fun, in the meantime!

I wouldn't kick one of those anniversary drums out of bed in any regard! They are beautiful, but like I say, I'd get as much "enjoyment" out of looking at a picture of one of Mike Curotto's Peacock Pearl snare drums. I don't know how much one of those goes for, now, but the fact that none of them will ever be built again just makes them all the more unattainable -and desirable.

[mcjnic]

I've never quite got my mind around this whole "collecting" thing. It's good that we are all wired differently. I am one that just doesn't get it. My whole life has been centered around playing drums. The idea of purchasing something BECAUSE it's rare is just strange to me. I remember the eBay 60s Luddy snare fairly recently that was sold as a new in plastic never been opened. I buy stuff to play it. They are drums, after all. It's a percussion instrument. It's meant to be hit. I remember the beanie babies thing. Cracked me up. People were freakin out over a new little stuffed animal. Adults were fighting over them. That's definitely not healthy behavior. I have a one of a kind snare. It is a TMNT snare custom built for me. It has the documentation from the creators of the TMNT granting permission to the one off drum, and a paper trail of all the other corporate thugs involved. It's a great sounding snare. I play it often. It doesn't sit in some glass case. It is extremely sensitive and is an incredible jazz snare. Love it. If others pay thousands for a drum to keep in a case on a shelf...well, it's thier dough to play with. As for me, I'll keep banging away on the kits that flow through my life. In all the kits that I've purchased over the years, I've lost money on very few. I've been lucky I guess. (other than the ones I've given away, but that could never be counted as a loss. that's an investment that can't be measured)

[Randydrummer]

Instruments are meant to be played....not put in a climate controlled glass box.

Billy Gibbons has one of the most sought after Les Pauls in history...partly because he owns and plays it....point is he still plays that beast!

I don't know of any drummer that has drums sitting on a pedestool in his or her home....hell I recently recorded with my 1930's K Constantinople.

If I could afford a Triumphal Snare....Id beat that sucker on every session I could bring it out on.

Think of all the "collectible" instruments we wish we could have....they were all played at some point:


Ringo's Sullivan Kit
Tony Williams cymbals
Anything Elvin Jones played
Bonham's Amber Vistalite
Charlie Watts Gretsch drums


You get my point.

[O-Lugs]

Yes, Randydrummer. I agree with you on that particular facet. But I would say that those examples are "beyond the factory", so-to-speak. In other words, if Bonham, Ringo, Elvin and all those people wouldn't have played those drums the way they did WHEN they did, then the association of them to their particular drum set might be different, today. We, as fans, associate their sound to the drums they played. But we all know that the sound really comes from the drummer, not the drums.

Conversely, if you or I hit a Triumphal snare drum, nothing is going to change for us. Neither of us will ever command the position those other drummers did. And no intrinsic value will be added to the snare that was played by O-Lugs or Randydrummer. See what I mean?

Now, if we remove the famous icons from those drums, then what is left? Answer: Just the drums.

I play all my vintage gear, btw.

As far as collecting something because it's rare....Well, I must say that I was hooked only about a decade ago into the collecting world. What I knew before then could fill a thimble! But since then, I have conversed with many people who are kind of the Antiques Roadshow kinds of people. Call us geeks, nerds, whatever. We like to treasure hunt! That's about the sum of it.

And the comment about all of us being different is always the bottom line. I don't like to eat seafood -never have. Other people love it. Guess what? I've never had an argument with anyone because they wanted to eat fish and I didn't! So, I hope there's no arguments about what someone values in terms of their tastes in drums and/or drumming. Even the smallest gear in a watch is essential to that watch keeping time. Collecting is a specialized hobby. Different people collect different things and they all have different styles and tastes. Drumaholic loves cymbals. Mike Curotto loves old snare drums. Bun Carlos likes old Ludwig drum sets. WFLKurt likes Mod Orange. Ludwig-dude like Black Panther finish drums...etc., etc.

I would rather have it be that we retain our own individual tastes and specialties at this forum, as a kind of "potluck", where we each can bring our own specialty to the table.

How much "street price-wise" does one f those gold Triumphal snare drums sell for, btw? And IF I could afford one, would it sound that much better or different than any nine other snare drums? So, then if it does come down to a matter of sound and playability, and it turns out there really isn't that much sonic difference, then what am I doing spending that kind of money? In other words, what am I really getting for the extra moolah? Answer: a really, really, really pretty drum!

Right?
:)

[Randydrummer]

Yep. A pretty drum indeed. Just like all the BDP Ludwig kits. Whether or not Ringo played them....they would still sound great and look cool. Now would they be some of the most sought after Ludwig's if The Beatles were not on Sullivan? Who's to say.

I totally agree with you on all your points.

But really...I haven't heard a snare drum like the Triumphal or for that matter seen something so gorgeous as that drum. So that coupled with the Anniversary aspect, the limited numbers, etc...this will surely become a collectors drum.

And who knows....200 years from now, some lucky person might find one in an attic estate sale and pick it up for what is the equivalent of $200 today.

So why don't I ever see great drums on The Antique Roadshow?
I must have missed that episode.

[O-Lugs]

RE: Antiques Roadshow with no drum experts...

Agree! I think Steve Maxwell or Mike Curotto should apply for the job! I would love to see what one of the old Civil War rope tensioned drums would sell for if one were to come up for appraisal. I know they are considered a "cross-collectible" due to the association to the war. War collectors want them. Historians want them. And drum collectors want them.

And you're point about what may come in 200 years from now is well taken.