Recutting Lauan edges

[teverson-sr]

I've had trouble cutting MIJ drum edges-vertical plies splitting and fraying,rendering the new edge useless.Any suggestions as in special router bits,particular angles etc?I'd like to try a sharper edge than the stock round over if posible.

[OsakaBop]

Call me a caveman, left handed, amateur but I gently re-work my luan bearing edges (carefully) with a simple wood file. First, I discovered thru trial and error that if I kneel on the floor in a certain way and place the drum on the floor then I can get quite a consistent downward angle on the file. I think of this as a natural angle of how my wrist feels comfortable. While I was filing away at some toms in this way I mused that this must be why the went to a 45 degree cut because that feels quite comfortable when filing downward on the drum (back in the day when they where designing these drums by hand)... Anyway, I have had good results with working them by hand. Recently a friend offered to cut them on his router table. Your post is a good warning to be careful and I look forward to reading about more people`s experiences.

[JRichard]

MIJ does not always equal quality. Often poor grades of wood were used as well as poor workmanship. You can try cutting a sharper edge (30*) but it will probaly split and shred. That's why they put roundover edges.
Maybe some epoxy filler might harded the edges for a sharper edge.

[Stallwart]

You might experiment with thin cyanoacrylate glue. It is the thin, watery version of super glue. Be careful, too much will run everywhere:eek:

It can be found at radio control hobby shops, since it works well for bonding and "hardening" wood in flying model airplanes. Ask for "Thin CA." They'll think you're one of them at the hobby shop.

If you try it, use adequate ventilation (it gives off cyanide fumes), and be sure to buy some de-bonder to un-stick your fingers in the likely event......DOH

[OsakaBop]

That`s a very good point. I bought a used Yamaha mid-70s luan kit for parts- and noticeably it had the absolute cheapest luan shells I have ever run across. I love drums from the botom of my heart and I took off the lugs and hardware and threw those shells away- I couldn`t believe I was doing it but they would have been useless.
On the flip side - if you ever get to see the 1970s Pearl DownBeat and Thunderking drums- I believe they are actually luan- but 9 ply. It`s such a high grade luan it`s got a reasonably nice grain and tighter texture. I don`t think it`s poplar...They aren't clear in the catalog about what kind of wood is in the 9 ply shell.... But those DownBeat and Thunderking shells are the very, very best of the possibilites of a luan drum IMO. I have the 69 Thunderking but this week just picked up another 75 Thunderking set and it is heavy, solid- Tyrannosaurus Luan. Along with lots of lugs around the bass drum and ft- you get a really nice tone. Those drums I bet you could recut without difficulty... So is it that you have to carefully examine your drum shell and decide how dense it is before you decide what angle to cut?

[jonnistix]

OK, my turn. I use sandpaper. It is a pain in the backside, but it works well, and you control the angles precisely. I start with 100 and work them to the rough shape I desire. I have been using the TAMA Starphonic contour and it works well for these shells, and can be found here: http://www.tamadrum.co.jp/STARPHONIC/key.html
It takes a little time and patience, however once you get the hang of it, you can finish them in about an hour. After you get the contour right, finish them off with soime 220 and they are ready to mount. Be sure not to overwork a single area, and go around the shell two or three times to ensure you have them evened out. I do not leave them with a really sharp knife edge, but a very pronounced edge, just rounded over.
"Hooked on sandpaper works for me...."
Would you like me to do a video showing the technique I employ to get them? If you "listen" to the shell, it will "tell" you how to cut it. It is more an innate feel than something you would hear, but I can hear it through my bones. Hard to explain, really, but each edge kind of has it's own desired contour, and I use that TAMA as a guide. As I have stated elsewhere, I was using that design before I knew TAMA was using it on the StarPhonics, so it must be a good one...
Then you can use your favorite edge goop to close the grain.

On another note, I am now workning with another drum teacher who works with at risk kids and the bass you sent is about to finally get a new home. BTW Tom, that shell is going to be the subject of the next restoration vid entitled Edge Repair 101, in which we will explore the ins and outs of ring re-attachment. Other than that it is a really nice shell, and sounds great! I put a head on it and geve it a test drive before stripping it and it booms nicely!
We are going to need a tom (12 or 13), if anyone has one I can pick up for super cheap, like 20 or less, or maybe a donor drum for the cost of shipping... It only needs to have lugs and hoops. Wrap color/condition is unimportant as it will get the jonni-glitter treatment.

[cn679]

I've had trouble cutting MIJ drum edges-vertical plies splitting and fraying,rendering the new edge useless.Any suggestions as in special router bits,particular angles etc?I'd like to try a sharper edge than the stock round over if posible.

I'd like to go on record regarding reshaping/re-cutting MIJ edges, not so much in response to the above bearing edge situation, as these edges have already been reshaped, but as a plea to anyone thinking about jumping in and reshaping/re-cutting their bearing edges.

If someone is contemplating doing work on their edges, it must be because the drum's sound is not to their liking. The drum may sound bad, or really, really bad. But before doing something that cannot be undone, please go through a few quick and easy steps first:

1. Inspect the edges in their present state. If the edge seems to be ok, put a new or newish (not beat up) head on the drum and tune it up. If the old head is original, you're looking at a stretched piece of plastic that has gone through 35-45 years of summers and winters, and it is most likely toast. If the old head is visibly beat up, you can see that it is toast, and it wont tune up no matter what the edges are like. With just a head replacement, tuning, and no other work, you may be very surprised with the improvement in sound and may be good to go. *There have been advancements in head technology in the last 40 years, so I believe that an original drum from this period, in its original state, will sound better with a new head than the drum did when it was brand new!* For the most part, any new Emp, Amb, Evans G1, your favorite Aquarian, whatever, will sound better than whatever was left on your drum for however many years.

2. If you are still unhappy with the drum's sound with a new head (after being played for a bit then retuned) try to give the edges a light sanding. 220 grit sand paper works well, and you dont need to dig into the edge, just a few times back and forth until the edge is smooth to the touch when you run your finger all the way around the edge. Put the (new) head back on then try tuning up again.

If at this point you are still unhappy with the drum's sound, you may consider modifying the edge's shape slightly. Try Jonnistix's method. But please, dont go full bore into a sharp edge as this basically takes the 'vintage' design of the drum away and you start to get into a more modern edge design, which may not work well with the drum's construction.

I know these drums do not have a lot of monetary value and are not, to most, regarded as 'collectors drums.' Nevertheless, I do not think that these should be seen as guinea pig sets that anyone with a router or file should start hacking away at. There are plenty of Percussion Plus, Coda, First Act, Sound Percussion, etc kits that can be had 2nd hand for basically nothing that I would invite any adventurous soul to go mad scientist on. We all know that they are not sacrosanct, but when working on the MIJ sets of the 60's, please, at the very least, proceed with much caution and consideration for these vintage instruments.

[teverson-sr]

Thanks everyone for the good tips and suggestions-I'll get to work on the over abundance of Lauan drums soon.I mostly would like to redo the Royce drums (toms).Just a little more attack.
I definitely agree with the heads first posting.I replaced the heads on a Tama Rockstar set I've rebuilt and they went from firewood to-I hate to say it-quite acceptable.Evans EC-2 coated tops and Ambassador clear bottoms.Clear Ambassador front head at Guitar Center-$35-ouch!

[OsakaBop]

I'd like to go on record regarding reshaping/re-cutting MIJ edges, not so much in response to the above bearing edge situation, as these edges have already been reshaped, but as a plea to anyone thinking about jumping in and reshaping/re-cutting their bearing edges.

If someone is contemplating doing work on their edges, it must be because the drum's sound is not to their liking. The drum may sound bad, or really, really bad. But before doing something that cannot be undone, please go through a few quick and easy steps first:

1. Inspect the edges in their present state. If the edge seems to be ok, put a new or newish (not beat up) head on the drum and tune it up. If the old head is original, you're looking at a stretched piece of plastic that has gone through 35-45 years of summers and winters, and it is most likely toast. If the old head is visibly beat up, you can see that it is toast, and it wont tune up no matter what the edges are like. With just a head replacement, tuning, and no other work, you may be very surprised with the improvement in sound and may be good to go. *There have been advancements in head technology in the last 40 years, so I believe that an original drum from this period, in its original state, will sound better with a new head than the drum did when it was brand new!* For the most part, any new Emp, Amb, Evans G1, your favorite Aquarian, whatever, will sound better than whatever was left on your drum for however many years.

2. If you are still unhappy with the drum's sound with a new head (after being played for a bit then retuned) try to give the edges a light sanding. 220 grit sand paper works well, and you dont need to dig into the edge, just a few times back and forth until the edge is smooth to the touch when you run your finger all the way around the edge. Put the (new) head back on then try tuning up again.

If at this point you are still unhappy with the drum's sound, you may consider modifying the edge's shape slightly. Try Jonnistix's method. But please, dont go full bore into a sharp edge as this basically takes the 'vintage' design of the drum away and you start to get into a more modern edge design, which may not work well with the drum's construction.

I know these drums do not have a lot of monetary value and are not, to most, regarded as 'collectors drums.' Nevertheless, I do not think that these should be seen as guinea pig sets that anyone with a router or file should start hacking away at. There are plenty of Percussion Plus, Coda, First Act, Sound Percussion, etc kits that can be had 2nd hand for basically nothing that I would invite any adventurous soul to go mad scientist on. We all know that they are not sacrosanct, but when working on the MIJ sets of the 60's, please, at the very least, proceed with much caution and consideration for these vintage instruments.

What is this? I am not going to comment on this father, I`m mean further. Wait, I can`t resist. Thanks for showing love to the MIJ; we all love them too. When I get the urge to use a chainsaw on a bearing edge I`ll PM you to stop me. In the mean time- I`ll go on working to create the sound that is for the music in me. No hard feelings I feel better now.

[cn679]

What is this? I am not going to comment on this father, I`m mean further.

Yeah, I'm sorry. You'll have to excuse me. I still reeling from the inexplicable loss UT suffered from an obviously inferior... wait, what forum is this?

Just had to let off some steam... no offense intended toward anyone.

[OsakaBop]

No hard feelings- this IS the internet. Everyone gets a free card weekly.Soap BoxYes Sir

[lucky]

You might want to try and move the shell in the opposite direction of the bit. You have to take care and go little bits at a time but going in reverse helps reduce,eliminate tearout. Then after you cut the edge in reverse go in the direction of the bit and it will finish the cut nice and clean.

[jonnistix]

I'd like to go on record regarding reshaping/re-cutting MIJ edges, not so much in response to the above bearing edge situation, as these edges have already been reshaped, but as a plea to anyone thinking about jumping in and reshaping/re-cutting their bearing edges.

2. If you are still unhappy with the drum's sound with a new head (after being played for a bit then retuned) try to give the edges a light sanding. 220 grit sand paper works well, and you dont need to dig into the edge, just a few times back and forth until the edge is smooth to the touch when you run your finger all the way around the edge. Put the (new) head back on then try tuning up again.

If at this point you are still unhappy with the drum's sound, you may consider modifying the edge's shape slightly. Try Jonnistix's method. But please, dont go full bore into a sharp edge as this basically takes the 'vintage' design of the drum away and you start to get into a more modern edge design, which may not work well with the drum's construction.

I know these drums do not have a lot of monetary value and are not, to most, regarded as 'collectors drums.' but when working on the MIJ sets of the 60's, please, at the very least, proceed with much caution and consideration for these vintage instruments.

I am working a kit right now, and I am going to make a new "How To:" so that it is more easily seen as to what I mean. The contour changes I make are, for the most part, very subtle, but they are changes nonetheless. The current kit has almost flat edges, theres no round over to speak of, and they are flat sounding. I know this part sounds silly, or almost "horse whisperer", but I "listen" to the wood, and the edge will shape itself, all I do is drive the sandpaper. I am going to use a 100 to 220 grit so that I can get them the way I want them. If a shell has true Ludwig or Sling rounded edges, I clean them up and put a very smooth 220 finish on them. The reason is that if the grain is closed the head will vibrate much more freely, and anytime you have a smooth surface, you have less friction, and that allows the heads to move freely.

[cn679]

The contour changes I make are, for the most part, very subtle, but they are changes nonetheless... I know this part sounds silly, or almost "horse whisperer", but I "listen" to the wood, and the edge will shape itself, all I do is drive the sandpaper... If a shell has true Ludwig or Sling rounded edges, I clean them up and put a very smooth 220 finish on them... if the grain is closed the head will vibrate much more freely, and anytime you have a smooth surface, you have less friction, and that allows the heads to move freely.

This method seems much more palatable to me. In many cases, this is exactly the type of work that an edge would need for a drum to sound its best. And I absolutely agree about having smooth surfaces for the heads.

I think a vid of this type of work would be a great addition to the site, especially if you're working on the WMP set so we can see how it's coming along!